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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-06 22:39:46  

20190706 211305
20190706 211334

Here are my latest swaged creations.

1/2 ogive @ 10.5 grains 

3/4 ogive @ 11.5 grains 

Tomorrow I will test about 6 different types of swaged pellets, these, in my opinion should be good performing projectiles.  Stay tuned

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

My Youtube Channel


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Motorhead
(@motorhead)
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Joined: 3 months ago
Posts: 51
2019-07-09 15:51:23  

Look like bullet nose bass/rubber worm fishing sinkers.

But there not !

Home of ... MOTORHEADS AG TUNING SERVICES
................... @ Northern California USA ....................
Sacramento Valley Field Target Club SVFTC Scott S


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-09 18:28:46  

Scott,

You are right......and I have some too!!! Not bad for a city slicker, right?

I'm setting up my new workbench for my swaging setup, I'll be making them in different weights in a day or 2.

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 


 

My Youtube Channel


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Will Piatt
(@will-piatt)
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Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 52
2019-07-10 06:42:54  

Tom,

I am watching with interest, keep up the posts.

Around 1972 I was heavy into shooting and reloading for .44 mag and .45 LC revolvers. I bought a bullet swaging dye set from Herter's catalog. Using my Rock Chucker reloading press I made thousands of SWC rounds from round balls that I cast from free wheel weights. They were the most accurate ammo I found at the time.


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
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Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 286
2019-07-10 08:57:55  
Posted by: Will Piatt

Tom,

I am watching with interest, keep up the posts.

Around 1972 I was heavy into shooting and reloading for .44 mag and .45 LC revolvers. I bought a bullet swaging dye set from Herter's catalog. Using my Rock Chucker reloading press I made thousands of SWC rounds from round balls that I cast from free wheel weights. They were the most accurate ammo I found at the time.

I am sure you know this, but for the younger crowd it may be news.

The RCBS brand name of reloading and shooting tools came precisely from your "Rock Chucker Bullet Swaging" press, AFTER that they went more into reloading and abandoned the swaging market.

Hope you still have that press, you could be making your pellets soon.

😉

 

 

HM


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Will Piatt
(@will-piatt)
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Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 52
2019-07-10 13:18:22  
Posted by: Hector J Medina G
Posted by: Will Piatt

Tom,

I am watching with interest, keep up the posts.

Around 1972 I was heavy into shooting and reloading for .44 mag and .45 LC revolvers. I bought a bullet swaging dye set from Herter's catalog. Using my Rock Chucker reloading press I made thousands of SWC rounds from round balls that I cast from free wheel weights. They were the most accurate ammo I found at the time.

I am sure you know this, but for the younger crowd it may be news.

The RCBS brand name of reloading and shooting tools came precisely from your "Rock Chucker Bullet Swaging" press, AFTER that they went more into reloading and abandoned the swaging market.

Hope you still have that press, you could be making your pellets soon.

😉

 

 

HM

I still have the press. Back then it replaced the common "C" press that I ruined early in the swaging learning curve. I have toyed with the idea of making a die similar to the Herters but for airguns for a long time, but the idea keeps getting pushed to the back burner. Now maybe Tom will perfect this and shorten our learning curve.  Too many ideas, not enough R&D time........


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-11 04:11:54  

Will, Hector,

What I have seems to work, within reason.  I'll stack a bunch at 55 yards, then a couple of flyers, then stack a bunch again.  Most likely has to do with consistent dwell time during the height of the power stroke.  

Also, from what others have said, given the head shapes I have, and the ones I have coming, it would be desirable for me to get different base shapes.  From what others have said, it makes a world of difference between a cup base, and a flat base.  The physical differences between the 2 is minimal, so a change from the current hollow base to a cup, or flat base might be the path to an accuracy ticket.  I only have a hollow base at the moment, and have 3 more base punches being made.  I also might need to lightly tumble these for a few minutes after swaging, just to knock down the sharp cookie cutter type edge that goes with the solid nose.  I don't have a picture of that posted, but once seen, you'll understand.

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

My Youtube Channel


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DRAGON64
(@dragon64)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 42
2019-07-11 06:50:02  

I would love to see a future video of the process, tools and material you use to swage your ammo.  


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-11 10:14:16  

Dragon, 

I'm going to have a full video of the entire process up hopefully by the end of the weekend, Monday at the latest.   That's my goal, anyway. 

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

My Youtube Channel


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
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Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 286
2019-07-12 09:36:57  
Posted by: @xbowairsniper1200

Will, Hector,

What I have seems to work, within reason.  I'll stack a bunch at 55 yards, then a couple of flyers, then stack a bunch again.  Most likely has to do with consistent dwell time during the height of the power stroke.  

Also, from what others have said, given the head shapes I have, and the ones I have coming, it would be desirable for me to get different base shapes.  From what others have said, it makes a world of difference between a cup base, and a flat base.  The physical differences between the 2 is minimal, so a change from the current hollow base to a cup, or flat base might be the path to an accuracy ticket.  I only have a hollow base at the moment, and have 3 more base punches being made.  I also might need to lightly tumble these for a few minutes after swaging, just to knock down the sharp cookie cutter type edge that goes with the solid nose.  I don't have a picture of that posted, but once seen, you'll understand.

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

Tom;

If you are getting some fliers, it means that you are at the limit of stability, one way or the other.

Base punches change dramatically the performance because they shift the CoG (Center of Gravity).

USUALLY, points do not affect performance as dramatically as bases.

A few photos of mine, way back when (2002):

Photo where you can clearly see the base  punch:

 

As discussed, I used a three die set and formed a dual diameter slug:

Point Forming Die:

Shoulder making die:

I tested different ojive closures because, for a given weight (core), that affects the OAL length of the bullet:

Never needed to tumble them. If you are getting "swarf" around the point, it means you are using too much pressure. Back the die out by 1/16th  of a turn and see how it looks like. Back it more, if need be

HTH.

IMHE, this design works well at high powers (35 ft-lbs 0.22" cal. Talon SS)

I am curious as to the results you get at 12 ft-lbs.

Keep well and keep us posted!

 

 

 

 

HM


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-12 10:19:58  

Hector,

I understand what you are saying, but I still think my flyers are due to the edge of stability as you said.  At the lower level of power that I am shooting, particularly with the hollow base, makes everything critical,  especially in weight.  

What Dave Corbin reccomended that I do, is, start at a minimum weight that seems to group ok.  Then increase the amount of weight by .2 of a grain, and keep going until it tightens up to their best.  When you go past the point where you get the groups spreading out again, go back to the point where they group the best, and if possible, change the base punch.  As I said, I can't do this as of yet, as I only have the one hollow base punch.  

This project has definite promise, and I'm almost to the point where I have decent groups at 55 yds.  All my testing is at 55.  If it doesn't perform in the wind at 55, then it would not perform well at closer distances.  

Still a work in progress, but with the limited punches and shapes that I have, I'm pretty optimistic. 

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech


 

My Youtube Channel


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-14 19:22:03  

Warriors,

Here is my next batch of pellets to test.  3/4 ogive, hollowpoint 10.86 grains.   I've made enough for a good testing session come next Saturday.

20190714 193512

 

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

My Youtube Channel


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
Member of Trade
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 286
2019-07-15 16:04:06  

That's a pretty deep base.

It looks to me that the swarf at the points comes from either closing too much the point, or using insufficient lube in the fixed/stationary punch during the core-swaging operation...

If the cores exhibit a paper thin end on either of the ends, then you are better off tumbling the cores, but not the finished bullets.

If my maths are right, for 12 ft-lbs 10.8 grs bullets in the order of 6.7 mm's OAL would require a 1/10"or a 1/8" twist to be truly stable.

Anyway, keep us posted!

 

 

 

HM


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Tom Holland
(@xbowairsniper1200)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 37
2019-07-15 20:49:21  

Hector,

The little bit of swarf is mainly on the solid nose pellets.  The curved nose punch leaves a small cookie cutter edge, that is almost unavoidable.  When I reverse the nose punch to the flat side, the pellet nose is more uniform.  

I have another die coming, as well as 3 different base punches.  Between the combination of dies, and base punches, I'll find something that will be suitable for a lower powered FT rig.

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

My Youtube Channel


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
Member of Trade
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 286
2019-07-16 09:25:08  
Posted by: @xbowairsniper1200

Hector,

The little bit of swarf is mainly on the solid nose pellets.  The curved nose punch leaves a small cookie cutter edge, that is almost unavoidable.  When I reverse the nose punch to the flat side, the pellet nose is more uniform.  

I have another die coming, as well as 3 different base punches.  Between the combination of dies, and base punches, I'll find something that will be suitable for a lower powered FT rig.

Tom Holland 

Field Target Tech 

Excellent, Tom.

 

Keep us posted.

 

 

 

HM


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