shooting distance is less than 25yds?
About the only reason I see is if it is too hard to cock a springer and I know that is a very good reason,so then ,what would be other reasons be?I mean with all the hassle filling a PCP,
I do have a couple PCPs,butt actually shoot my Hammerli 850 way more often plus my PCPs can be filled with a hand pump.
I know guys would say if you go to the "dark side" there is no turning back;I do not hear that very much anymore.
Another thing,I see most of the PCP shooters using a bench,yet they say it is a lot easier to shoot a pcp,will then why use a bench,I know because you are shooting at a much longer distance,right?
Well then it seems it would be a lot harder to shoot a PCP in your backyard because how many people have enough yard to shoot over 50yds.
So I guess if you are Not a target shooter or a hunter a springer would be a better choice,No,Why not.
I don't know ,maybe I using this as a "sounding board" or to hear what others thought.
So what do you think?
so Jesse if your not hunting or target shooting what are you doing with your air gun
so for you would be easier for you to shoot your 850 or a springer in the same power range, I'm guessing the 850
what takes more technique the 850 or the springer, I'm guessing the springer
even if you are just shooting tin cans you have to have accuracy and technique but is that target shooting, maybe not
so the springer is cheaper to shoot and the 850 easier, shouldn't we all of the above
and we haven't talked about pumper or SSP but maybe at another date
take care
mike
So here's where CO2 comes in. Remarkably consistent shot to shot, without a whole bunch of tech. Reasonable power for backyard ranges. Easily quieted for said backyard. Recoil-less accuracy. Gas guns will never be able to compete at 50+ yds, but inside 30, hard to beat. (Same holds true for pumpers, but the physical input is a non-starter for some folks.)
If your range is less than 25 yards, why have an air rifle? Pistols are fun at those distances.
I think the answer is that it is fun to shoot different airguns. All of them are different and a lot of us get enjoyment from the variety.
David Enoch
OK,I have many air rifles and pistols and I target shoot them .Most of the pistols are CO2,most of the rifles are springers,most have been "reworked"and are English and German made.
I shoot "offhand"and have been doing so for over 50yrs...so a good trigger is a must.
Dave is right about different rifles and pistols,I do not know how many I have,butt I do know my favorites.
25 Yards with a pistol is waaaaay harder than with a rifle,heck a bet if a bench rest a pistol I would still shoot better offhand with a rifle,maybe not ,come to think of it I can shoot a .45 pretty good at that distance,butt that's not a fair comparison as I think a pellet pistol is harder to shot because it does not feel as good and makes smaller holes,LOL.
Shooting "offhand" is a different skill set than shooting off a bench,both are fun when you can hit where you want to.
Thank you guys for your input.
People can discuss this to death and never get a correct answer. I have both PCP and spring guns. It's just personal choice. An Argument can be made in favor of either.
Rick B.
shooting distance is less than 25yds?
About the only reason I see is if it is too hard to cock a springer and I know that is a very good reason,so then ,what would be other reasons be?I mean with all the hassle filling a PCP,
I do have a couple PCPs,butt actually shoot my Hammerli 850 way more often plus my PCPs can be filled with a hand pump.
I know guys would say if you go to the "dark side" there is no turning back;I do not hear that very much anymore.
Another thing,I see most of the PCP shooters using a bench,yet they say it is a lot easier to shoot a pcp,will then why use a bench,I know because you are shooting at a much longer distance,right?
Well then it seems it would be a lot harder to shoot a PCP in your backyard because how many people have enough yard to shoot over 50yds.
So I guess if you are Not a target shooter or a hunter a springer would be a better choice,No,Why not.
I don't know ,maybe I using this as a "sounding board" or to hear what others thought.
So what do you think?
I like watching sparrows and starlings explode. 😉
Actually, for most of my shooting, it really dosn't matter; at least not on inanimate objects or pest birds. At least out to something more like 75-100 feet (call it 25-33 yards).
Normally in the warm months, will use a lot more co2 Really don't find it does any better or worse than PCP's at that range.
Springers? I do shoot them, and can do well with them, but there always seems to be one or two shots out of every 20 where I just "blow it" and they land well away of where I intended them. IGNORE all the other types of power plants, practice exclusively with springers, and the fewer the "odd shots"and the less far the occasional odd shot lands....so I know the "odd shots" are a biologic error rather than a mechanical one.
That seems so "selfish" of springers.....demanding that you pay attention only to them and ignore all the other power plants. Am thinking I'm already married and she has the same basic rules.
So I'd go with a "yes". Go ahead and get am PCP SUITED to 25 yardback yard po9wer levels for plinking/ sinner playing/pest birding. Something likely in .177, drifting along at something like 9-12 foot pounds, and at least close to match accurate.
Lets just call the tweety-bird kill zone a tradtioanl "M&M". If you can hit the "M&M" the little critter falls down like a dropped soggy french fry. Getting accuracy to 1/2 an M&M really isn't going to help except in paper target shooting for groups.
Be "stealth" at home, keep it low energy and really quiet. It's summer, the neighbors are out and about and would appreciate it (andbecasue they don't complain, you benefit too).
Not sure I understand the question. I've been shooting springers well over 25Y/M for years and years. Typically zero them for 35.
This is like asking why shoot a 308 if the range is only 100m long. Why buy a Porche when the speed limit is only 55. Why eat the whole plate when you only need three bites to survive.
I could go on....
I guess my own best answer is "Because I can".
Simple...
because I want one.
If all a person is doing is shooting tins cans, most any power plant will do. A springer will keep up with a pcp to 25 yards but some folks don’t like to compress the spring. Some environments/seasons don’t maximize CO2. Others may not want to pump a MSP or even a PCP. It’s really all about intended purpose and personal preference.
I like spring guns but hate side lever spring guns. I prefer a break barrel over an under lever but I enjoy them both. Some like power where a PCP would shine. Some like rifles where others like pistols. How about a multi shot vs. a single shot? What about a $35 Daisy pumper vs. a $2000 PCP or even a + $3000 Olympic level rig?
They all do do the same thing just a bit different. Me personally I enjoy them all.
OK...lets see how you view it.
Have continued practice with a good (although cheap) springer, and can manage some very good shot strings (5X5 shot groups at 20 yards) that run right at 1/3".Good (altrhough cheap) CO2 will run about .29" for the same series of 25 shots. Cheap (under $200...likely $210 now) PCp will run about .25 for the same 5X5 shot test.
(Yeah..stick with .177 for this...although I can do it again in either .22 or 5mm...am lacking a good co2 25 to do it for that caliber).
So, what real difference on swingers, paintballs, bottle caps, or pest birds at 20-30 yards?
Totally agree with PCP for farther ranges or bigger critters....but when that's not on the agenda, why put up with the noise/air use/safe back stops for 90=95% of the daily shooting that gets done?
For me, it's about versatility more than anything else. I can shoot my pcp guns off a bench, resting against a tree, from a bipod, or freehand, and I won't have to worry about how the different surfaces the gun rests on will affect the point of impact. While I still think about trigger discipline and controlling my breathing, I don't need to worry about whether or not I'm holding the gun just right in any given situation. Since I use my guns primarily for pest control, and my shots are often taken from many different angles requiring different positions to make a humane shot, it's one less major variable to have to consider.
Chris
So...lets see how ya'll see the difference:
All are "cheap rifles" (available for $110 to $200 as of 4 months ago).
Same distance (20 yards...but can assert that none of them "go stupid" (the "death sprial" of pellets) oput tpo 33 yards.
Same basic paper targets (although one has ornage centers).
Each 5 shots X 5 tagets (to rule out a "freak" bragging group.)
Same dumb-azz human tripping the sear from the same rest.
A co2, a PCP, a low powered springer, and a higher power springer.
TAke a guess as to which power plant (co2/PCP/Lo-Springer /HI=Springer) shot the following:
#1:
#2:
#3:
#4:
QUESTIONS:
1.For the range (20-30 yards),is accuracy really a concern?
2. For the range (20-30 yards), is the power really a concern?
3. Theis is a definative result on paper (like 1/12 to 1/14 of an inch), but in real life, is it enougfh to really make a "rat'sarse" of practical difference?
If you are limited to 25 yards, why shoot anything but a SSP? Low power, so you get to learn to read the wind like shooting a high power PCP at 50 yds, no recoil to spoil the random shot, no springer hold to learn and remember, no co2 to buy, yet as slef contained as a springer, accurate enough for tiny targets at 25 yards (hornets , calcium tablets, flies, empty .22 rimfire shells standing in for pop cans...)
You( Ribbonstone) represent the "silent majority" of airgunners who mostly shoot in their backyards which are 20-30 yards long and do not need any of the fancy equipment that are mostly talked about in the various review videos and internet forums.
In the last ten years have rarely shot beyond 45 yards and mostly my shooting range between 25 and 35 yards, or at 8 yards in my basement, and I have concluded even though I should like to have my pcps-- which are all sub 12 fpe in .177-- what I could do with would be my HW77 (sub 12 fpe again). That's really all I NEED-- everything else is somewhat of a choice. I can shoot smaller groups with my BSA or S410, but smaller by a fifth of an inch at 35 yards means nothing for a casual shooter. 95% of my shooting is standing offhand at spinners kept between 30-35 yards and I can shoot them just as well with the HW77 as I can with my BSA or AA. 1 inch spinners do not care about that 1/5" smaller group size! True, I can shoot spinners 10 out of 10 times on a mediocre day with the pcps and only 7-8 times with the springer, but again does it really matter so much for a casual afternoon's shooting? On a good day(usually if I practice for a day with the HW77), there's no difference in my number of hits between the springer and the pcp.
There is however one usage of a multishot pcp-- shooting a texas star target I bought. It is immensely fun and challenging to shoot at 30 yards standing, but does require a multishot to be truly fun.
You should start a series on backyard airguns-- I can't think of anyone else who has so consistently upheld the virtues of low power airguns with sensible low power optics. For me that kind of shooting is still the essential heart of airgunning.
p.s: You are Gubb from the old Yellow Forum, aren't you? I recognize your targets and writing style. Anyway that was my assumption.
Cause we like airguns and want to have at least one of them in all powerplants available... Just guessing here .I don't personally own a pcp or see one in my future soon.. But... Why not.. If you can afford it.. Even if it sits unused in the safe. ..but what do I know. ..?
A spring or Co2 powered air gun would be a better choice fro people who shoot at less than 50 yards or in small 25 yard back yards. No need for a PCP. a PCP is easier to shoot because it's more accurate...not an issue at 25-35 yards no matter what your shooting.
Here is the best springer for the price: my HW97 Review Video
What you shoot most often should get more attention. Human nature makes the newest or fastest the most posted (kind of like a car magazine in that respect...articles about a 2006 F-150 won't sell magazines, but we'll rely on that truck every day).
And I do like to shoot every day at least a little. All I really need for back yard shooting/pesting:
1. Reliable
2. Accurate
3. QUIET (can really only PO the neighbors ONCE)
4. As safe a back stop as is possible (which goes with the neighbors idea above).
5. Enough energy to get the job done, but no so much as to reduce #3 and #4.
NOTES:
#1. Yeah...#3...quiet. Lots of folks think their hot-rod airguns are quiet. Bring the rifle indoors into the bathroom (lots of nice hard sound reflective surfaces) and crank off a"blank shot" (no pellet). See if the wife will let you do that unexpectedly at random times during the day.
#2. Enough energy for the job (#5). Ready doesn't take much to flip a spinner, pop a paintball, push a hole though target paper, or even zap a pest bird.
#3. Vanity..we all have a bit to some degree. From the previous post's targets, really doesn't matter what power plant fires the pellet...pellet's have no memory, only the shooter knows/cares about the launch pad. I care (vanity) how well it does it more than what did it.
We all live different places.
While the R9 might be lightning in my yard, last time I took it to a REAL range it was 4ft low, and I could shoot under MOA with my old Marlin .22.
Priorities are... don't be overgunned!
CO2 or spring, accuracy with light pellets, ease of service.
My bait piles are 60+ft up a Queen Palm, and after 50yds there is nothing (mine) left to shoot at.
Spending $$$$ on "long range, high energy" air rifles is false economy when powder abounds.
Someone down the block just wasted a pit with a 870, dog catcher said "Good job, use #6 or #8 instead of #4, and don't do it again."
Another guy was asking me to do pest control, with an airgun. BIG raccoons.
Why not powder? Why not a a trap? Why not do it his dang self?
Why should I wait all night just to wound something and hear him B**** about a dead coon under the shed?
Why does the groundhog still make it back to the borrow even with a .22lr through the boiler room?
Not enough gun.
Yet at my current location, I would be drastically overgunned with .22lr.
