Some spreadsheet fu...
 

Some spreadsheet fun  

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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-03 13:58:54  

So, I currently have 32 airguns in my revolving-door collection.  I decided to sort by powerplant:

Spring piston - 14

CO2 - 12

Multi-pump - 4

Single-stroke pneumatic - 2

Then I decided to sort by country of origin:

USA - 12

China - 9

Germany - 2

Russia - 2

Hungary - 2

Spain - 2

England - 1

Mexico - 1

Taiwan - 1

Interesting exercise.


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ekmeister
(@ekmeister)
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Posts: 497
2019-12-03 14:21:09  
Posted by: @jiminpgh

So, I currently have 32 airguns in my revolving-door collection.  I decided to sort by powerplant:

Spring piston - 14

CO2 - 12

Multi-pump - 4

Single-stroke pneumatic - 2

Then I decided to sort by country of origin:

USA - 12

China - 9

Germany - 2

Russia - 2

Hungary - 2

Spain - 2

England - 1

Mexico - 1

Taiwan - 1

Interesting exercise.

Hey Jim, thanks for sharing! At least in my mind, you've raised as many questions as you answered LOL.

As far as USA guns, I can only think of perhaps Benjamin, Sheridan, Crosman, and Daisy. Am I forgetting anyone? I think there was a company called Sterling in business for a while, that made some springers, but I think they've been gone for a long time if I'm not mistaken.

The count of 9 on the Chinese guns is pretty high. I'm a bit surprised, especially as it compares to only two German guns. You didn't mention any makes and models, but maybe we can do it this way:

Of the Chinese guns, which one is your favorite, and why? By all means pick at least two if necessary. Please include caliber if you don't mind. Have any of them been tuned, by yourself or anyone else? I know that a tune can often improve them quite a bit, although it still doesn't turn them into a European gun. But, I hear the guy at Flying Dragon Airguns has done some good things with them. I think maybe his name is Mike.

Anyway, to be clear I'm not knocking your ownership of the Asian guns. I'm just making a statement, and asking some questions.

Maybe even more than that, there seems to be a VERY-glaring omission. You know where this is going. I don't see a PCP anywhere in there. I'm not counting  the single stroke pneumatic guns, you know the type I mean.  So, have you ever owned one? They've certainly gotten pretty affordable. Now, if you read my posts, you know I'm mostly a springer guy. But, then, I only own two air rifles. If I had a collection as big as yours, I think that even I would feel like I had to have a PCP in there somewhere. Care to share any thoughts or comments?

Bottom line to me, I find your post interesting, and the answers to the questions I asked could make it even more so. Thanks.

Safe and Happy Shooting!

Ed, the Airgun TuneMeister

https://www.airguntunemeister.com/


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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-03 15:41:56  

Just for you Ed.  Here's a sort of the exact same data, but this time by the brand name they were sold under:

Air Venturi - 2

Baikal - 2

Beeman - 1

BSA - 1

Crosman - 7

Daisy - 5

Dan Wesson - 1

Diana - 3

Gamo - 2

Haenel - 1

Hahn - 1

Industry - 1

MRodAir - 1

Neckermann - 1

Relum - 1

RWS - 1

Winchester - 1

 


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ekmeister
(@ekmeister)
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2019-12-03 15:59:33  

@jiminpgh

Thanks!

You said the count on the Chinese guns was 9. I feel sure I remember that the Industry brand would be one of them. It sounds like the Hahn brand could also be one of them, based on the spelling of that name. I don't know which one of the other ones are Chinese.  There are even a few of the brand's you named that I've never heard of before. That's okay. I'm not trying to make you jump through hoops.

Getting back to my questions, which of the 9 Chinese guns is your favorite? And, did it have any kind of tuning work done to it? Or is it bone stock?

Safe and Happy Shooting!

Ed, the Airgun TuneMeister

https://www.airguntunemeister.com/


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Citizen K
(@citizen-k)
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2019-12-03 16:13:54  
Posted by: @ekmeister

Hahn brand

PY Hahn Mfg. Fairport, NY. aka the BB division of Crosman in the early days (1959 to 1961) . Also president of Crosman from 1939 to 1971

 

Forum Janitorial Services Specialist


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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-03 16:15:53  

OK Ed, I won't leave you hanging.  My Chinese guns consist of:

RWS 320, Air Venturi TR5, Air Venturi Dragonfly, MRodAir Plinkster, Industry Brand QB2079B, two Diana Chasers (.177 and .22,) Beeman P17, and Daisy 880.

My favorite has got to be the QB. I've been working on it for years, and turned it into a respectable 10M gun.  But down your alley, I think you'd like my RWS320, which is a dead-nuts clone of the Beeman R9.  I did tune it, with a sized JM Apex seal and Tarantula spring,  just a hint of tar.  Very sweet shot cycle, right at 12.5 ftlb with 7.9s.

Here's the cool thing about my particular RWS 320: the serial number on the breech block is B320001


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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-03 19:17:26  
Posted by: @citizen-k
Posted by: @ekmeister

Hahn brand

PY Hahn Mfg. Fairport, NY. aka the BB division of Crosman in the early days (1959 to 1961) . Also president of Crosman from 1939 to 1971

 

Correct.  Hahn Super Repeater Gas Powered BB Rifle.  P Y Hahn Mfg Co Inc Fairport, NY.

Best BB gun EVER!  Mine shoots with authority and accuracy, especially when using .177 Gamo lead round balls.


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DavidEnoch
(@davidenoch)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 285
2019-12-04 11:02:50  

I believe the Hyscore pistols and the old Quackenbush were made in the USA.  AirForce is made here in Texas, and that is kinda part of the USA.

Customs like the USFT, RAW, Quackenbush big bores, Barnes, etc are made here.

David Enoch


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ekmeister
(@ekmeister)
Member of Trade
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2019-12-04 11:56:26  

@davidenoch

Yeah, David, good comments all of those about the other U.S. made air guns. My brain wasn't entirely engaged.

Nice joke about Texas, too! There are still some people who want to secede from the Union, but for now you and I are still part of the United States--I think. (??).  I better check the morning paper, though, just in case LOL.

Safe and Happy Shooting!

Ed, the Airgun TuneMeister

https://www.airguntunemeister.com/


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EricinMaine
(@ericinmaine)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 60
2019-12-04 13:43:12  

Jiminpgh   Who is making what in Mexico?

Also,Daisy is now owned by Gamo.Are they all still being made in the US as Gamo originally promised?

EricinMaine-


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chrisT
(@christ)
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Posts: 26
2019-12-04 15:29:55  

 Sterling was a division of Sheridan -  at the time of introduction it was already the way behind the trends . Benjamin and Sheridan were acquired by Crosman .  Crosman has a habit of not following up on a good thing ( or call it bean counter mentality). The sterling had potential but the ball was dropped.  It wasn't really a unit that fit in to crossmans marketing along with Sheridan 5mm rifle ( 20 cal apx) vs the 177 and 22 Benj units of the same ilk.


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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-04 16:39:25  
Posted by: @ericinmaine

Jiminpgh   Who is making what in Mexico?

Also,Daisy is now owned by Gammo.Are they all still being made in the US as Gammo originally promised?

EricinMaine-

My only Mexican gun is a Crosman Model RM650 BB gun. It clearly states in the stamping  "Manufactured for Crosman Corp by Productos Mendoza, SA"  It also bears 3 Mendoza logos, one of which states "Hecho en Mexico"  It's a nice little BB gun, and a decent approximation of a Red Ryder, but clearly not a clone.

To my knowledge, there are no current offerings from Mexico by other manufacturers, but there have been Crosman spring guns in the past made by Mendoza.  Also of note, the Tom Gaylord-designed Air Venturi Bronco rifle is based on a Mendoza springer.

With regard to current Daisy offerings, I have no information.  I currently own 5 Daisys, a 753 (USA,) 887 (USA,) Red Ryder (USA,) Model 25 (USA,) and 880 (China.)

[EDIT]  Both my Red Ryder and Model 25 are vintage.  As I understand, current models of both are manufactured in China.


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JiminPGH
(@jiminpgh)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 369
2019-12-04 17:14:34  
Posted by: @christ

 Sterling was a division of Sheridan -  at the time of introduction it was already the way behind the trends . Benjamin and Sheridan were acquired by Crossman .  Crossman has a habit of not following up on a good thing ( or call it bean counter mentality). The steriling had potential but the ball was dropped.  It wasn't really a unit that fit in to crossmans marketing along with Sheridian 5mm rifle ( 20 cal apx) vs the 177 and 22 Benj units of the same ilk.

I used to own a Sterling HR81, mfg by Sheridan.  It was an interesting underlever spring rifle, somewhat heavy for its moderate power, with a unique bolt-action loading port.  BEAUTIFUL fit and finish.  Apparently, they were trying to sell these guns as elite top-end rifles, a market that Sheridan was not well versed in.  Unfortunately, performance didn't back that up.  My understanding (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is that Sheridan purchased the rights to produce Sterlings somewhere around 1988, and continued to build them until around 1994, before finally giving up.

I understand from research that original British Sterlings are roughly equal in performance, but somewhat superior in manufacture.


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
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2019-12-05 08:49:03  
Posted by: @jiminpgh
Posted by: @christ

 Sterling was a division of Sheridan -  at the time of introduction it was already the way behind the trends . Benjamin and Sheridan were acquired by Crossman .  Crossman has a habit of not following up on a good thing ( or call it bean counter mentality). The steriling had potential but the ball was dropped.  It wasn't really a unit that fit in to crossmans marketing along with Sheridian 5mm rifle ( 20 cal apx) vs the 177 and 22 Benj units of the same ilk.

I used to own a Sterling HR81, mfg by Sheridan.  It was an interesting underlever spring rifle, somewhat heavy for its moderate power, with a unique bolt-action loading port.  BEAUTIFUL fit and finish.  Apparently, they were trying to sell these guns as elite top-end rifles, a market that Sheridan was not well versed in.  Unfortunately, performance didn't back that up.  My understanding (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is that Sheridan purchased the rights to produce Sterlings somewhere around 1988, and continued to build them until around 1994, before finally giving up.

I understand from research that original British Sterlings are roughly equal in performance, but somewhat superior in manufacture.

Hmmm, I THINK it was the other way around.

Benjamin bought Sheridan in 1977, and they were bought again by Crosman in 1992.

Sterling began making the HR81 and HR83 in about 1982 and 1983 respectively, the company  went bankrupt in the UK in 1984 and the new owners were not interested at all in airguns, so the airguns were phased out. Sterling Armaments was resurrected in 2016, but it is too busy with Defence markets to bother with airguns, prototypes that have been ready, and promised to market by "August 2018" never materialized. An offshoot of Sterling (Boxall and Edminston.- Bespoke Shotgun Makers), was closed down recently.

Yes, in 1988 Benjamin Sheridan bought the rights (and possibly the assets) and all production was moved to Racine, Wis (Sheridan plant).

Benjamin Sheridan was purchased by Crosman Corporation in 1992, then in 1994 the Racine plant was closed to move all manufacturing to East Bloomfield, NY, and the Sterling was discontinued for good.

The Sterling HR81 and HR83 showed that no matter how well an airgun is finished, if it does not have the performance to match the looks, it will not sell.

HTH

 

 

 

 

 

 

HM

 

PS.- I just bought an HR81 and I THINK it can be a fantastic performer, it just needs a little bit of further engineering.

 

😉


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DavidEnoch
(@davidenoch)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 285
2019-12-05 09:27:22  

Yeah, if the Sterling had the power and accuracy of a TX200 or HW97 and that neat bolt action it would have been a great seller.

Too much to ask, or wish for I guess.

David Enoch


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