Hello
Back in ocOctob I ordered a Artemis p15 from the Netherlands. I was looking for a light short sub 600.00 bullpup to pack around behind the seat of my truck that would shoot out to 50 yards .
So I ordered a p15 in .25 after reading on it for a few weeks .when it shows up I put a bipod and a aeon scope on it air it up and go out to zero it in . And quickly find that it won't group at 50 yards .
I mean I get better groups with my super x 3 imp.cylinder with 7 shot than this thing will do .
So I email the retailer and they send a call tag .
A few days after they get it back I get an email from them saying they had there gunsmith look it over and they have the problem fixed . So a few days later I get it back .same routine . Set up and start shooting same results .
So I email them again and am told the barrel is in spec for that rifle and there is nothing more they can do .
You can't hit a beer can at 20 yards with it .
So now I have a paper weight that needs another 3 or 400 into it for a lw barrel to make it shoot .
We all make mistakes and learn from them .
Looking back I should have put a little more money with it and bought another rifle from a dealer that services what they sell and takes care of there customer.
I have a cricket that is a tack driver .was just looking for something cheap that if it was stolen it wouldn't be a high dollar loss .
Forgot to add .after the email from them saying there was nothing they could do .
I took the barrel off and found the problem it has a tight spot about 6 inches in from the breech that is clipping the pellets . I have tried working it with a .25 Cal cotton bore swab and valve lapping compound attached to a cordless drill .
It's a little better pushing pellets but still won't group.
Bill by no means is this you're fault . I just want people to know my experience with this retailer and the way they treated me . There are plenty of good retail shops that will take care of there customers . You got lucky and got a good gun and didn't have to deal with any returns or warranty.
Forgot to add .after the email from them saying there was nothing they could do .
I took the barrel off and found the problem it has a tight spot about 6 inches in from the breech that is clipping the pellets . I have tried working it with a .25 Cal cotton bore swab and valve lapping compound attached to a cordless drill .
It's a little better pushing pellets but still won't group.
If in fact the problem is a tight spot in the bore, I want to say that I have successfully repaired such tight spots before. A cotton swab and lapping compound isn't going to do it in my experience, and a rotary drill isn't the right tool to use, either.
A lapping compound like JB Bore Paste is fine, but you need to use a brass bore brush, not swabs. Yes I said a brass brush, and it's okay because you're not going to use it over the entire length of the bore, and you're going to make sure you don't take too many passes of the brush over the tight spot (if you do it according to these conservative and cautious instructions).
First, you need to push a pellet with the bore rod you're going to use so you can mark exactly on the rod where the tight spot is. Then attach the brass brush, and load it up with your lapping compound. Now insert it into the bore to the tight spot and give just that small area about let's say 10 Strokes in then out, in and out finishing the last few strokes just a small amount longer then the tight spot. Now remove the rod and brush, thoroughly clean-out any lapping compound that is in the bore, and try pushing another pellet to and past that same spot to see if you have loosened it up sufficiently. You may need to do it a second time if you get what I'm saying. But if it's loose you won't need to use the brush again.
Now put a cotton patch on the end of the rod loaded up with your lapping compound or bore paste again. Now apply longer in and out Strokes over that area that was tight, to smooth out any scratches the brush may have left if you see what I'm saying.
Now once again push the lapping compound out of the boar and clean it what's a good cleaning agent like maybe some Birchwood Casey Sheath on patches.
At that point you'll be ready to do your testing to see if your accuracy has improved.
One main point I hope you picked up is that you don't want to use a circular motion like you were trying to do with a drill. You want to go in and out, directly in line with a rifling in the bore, which is also parallel to the barrel. If you use a rotary motion with your brush, even if you succeed in loosening the spot, you will probably damage the rifling with no hope of fixing the accuracy problem. Don't worry about what you did with the drill because I feel 99% sure that the cotton swab and lapping compound you used would have not have been aggressive enough the cause any damage. Just realize that with the brass brush, you ARE using a tool that can remove too much metal if you do it wrong, so don't overdo it this time. If you're uncomfortable with 10 passes in and out, do five passes in and out. See what I mean? Be conservative in your approach--better to take twice or even three times as long than damage the bore.
Like I said, using the method I just described I have successfully repaired the accuracy of several barrels that had tight spots in the middle of the bore. In fact, springers with choked barrels are extremely sensitive to such tight spots, because they can reduce the size of the pellet to a size that is smaller than the choke on the end of the barrel, and that's 'backwards' with what the choke was intended to do, which is to be the smallest size in the entire bore.
I'm going to add a little footnote here about something I have found useful when attempting something that could cause irreversible damage, like this project: don't act too quickly, take some time to mentally mull it over or do a dry run in your head before you touch a single tool or part. In other words, sleep on it enough nights to where you finally have an exact, clear picture of what you want to do and how you're going to do it. When you're comfortable and confidant with that, THEN start the project. And, worth stating, having a 'scrap' barrel around to practice on first is also a plus, but we don't always have such a luxury at our disposal.
HTH. It should.
Forgot to add .after the email from them saying there was nothing they could do .
I took the barrel off and found the problem it has a tight spot about 6 inches in from the breech that is clipping the pellets . I have tried working it with a .25 Cal cotton bore swab and valve lapping compound attached to a cordless drill .
It's a little better pushing pellets but still won't group.
Call Pyramyd Air and ask if they have DIANA Skyhawk replacement barrels. Or if they can get you one.
HTH
HM
idea in this post look for jamrstrong post almost half way down
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=133936.0
What does the pellet feel like after it pushes through the tight spot? Can you still feel the restriction at the choke? If so, the tight spot might not be hurting anything. BUT! An overly tight choke almost always will. Even high end guns are ruined by chokes that are too tight.
To remove either restriction, the best way (and most labor intensive) is to cast a lead lap in the bore to size it out. It ain't as hard as it sounds, even I managed to do it 🙂 Read here:
https://airgunwarriors.com/resources/library/Hand_Lapping_An_Airgun_Bore.pdf
If yours just rattles down the bore after the restriction, and all the way out the muzzle, then disregard all this. You have found the issue. But if that's the case, adding a slightly tighter choke could save it.
Just thinking out loud. Been there, and it sucks. I hate it for you bud.
The pellet pretty much falls out after the tight spot .
That actually sounds about right based on the problem you've described. You can't even begin to judge the rifle's accuracy potential with that being the case. I wouldn't be dismayed about the loose fit after the tight spot just yet.
Since you have a tight spot, it's going to squeeze down the size of the pellet there, so that the rest of the bore past that spot feels like it's too-loose. If you can remove the pesky tight spot, it's very possible that the fit along the entire bore will then become uniform along its whole length, with better accuracy being the result.
It's the same symptom I've seen with barrels that had tight spots somewhere in the mid-part of the bore, and it almost-always went away once I removed the tight spot.
BTW, once you've corrected the tight spot, if the fit of pellets still seems a little loose in the bore, your rifle may favor pellets in larger sizes/with a tighter fit (for the caliber). One thing at a time, though--see what you can do about that tight spot if you are so-inclined.
Bryan;
One thing you can do, that is easy to do and cannot hurt a barrel that is already a problem:
1.- Get some valve grinding compound.
2.- Get some lead-free pellets (tin), either GTO's or Barracuda Green's in your caliber.
3.- Get two pieces of steel or glass plate.
4.- Spread an EVEN coat of the COARSE valve grinding compound on both plates.
5.- Roll some pellets between the two plates using moderate pressure (you want to embed SOME abrasive on the pellets).
6.- Shoot them WITHOUT ANY LDC/SHROUD/Air stripper on the end of the barrel (wear ear and eye protection).
7.- After 10 to 15 pellets like this fired, re-test your barrel by pushing an uncoated lead-free pellet. See if the barrel improved.
8.- Clean the barrel real well with JB Bore paste.
9.- Test with normal pellets.
It is a somewhat "heroic" measure, but it works in really bad cases.
Hope it helps and keep us posted!
HM
I'm sure if I could have walked in there store it would have been a different story they would have replaced it ,but since I'm in another country they figured they could get away with what they did . If I would have thought about it sooner I would have contested the credit card charge
I did send it back to krale .
They did send a call tag otherwise it was going to cost me 250.00 to send a 450 dollar gun back .
They had there gunsmiths look at it and said there was nothing wrong with it .
I am no gunsmith but I did find the problem and when I contacted them about it I was told there was nothing else they could do about it .
I am curious to know what came about after you sent back the P15 to Krale (on their dime), did they send it back to you after they had 3 people verify that nothing was wrong with the gun?
I noticed one pop up recently for sale matching your description for $375 on another airgun classifieds website.
Did Krale actually eat 2 way shipping internationally for this and send it back to you?
I would have tried to slug and lap the barrel at that tight spot and try shooting it first before putting it up for sale. There would be nothing to lose at that point if it shot bad anyway IMHO.
Then sell it after at the very least, first trying.
I have seen wonders done to Chinese barrels lately, you would be really surprised!
HA
Yes they sent me the same gun back and there shipping cost is about 40 dollars . I did try lapping the barrel and managed to loosen the spot up some but not entirely.
And yes I sold the rifle just got tired of messing with it , I have enough projects to keep me busy at the moment and was tired of looking at it sit on the shelf
