What is the PCP ver...
 

What is the PCP version of the HW30s?  

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Frankly
(@frankly)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 33
2018-05-12 21:22:47  

I love my HW30s springer air rifle. Simple, reliable, accurate, good quality at a fair price. 

I've had some higher end PCPs but they were all on the large and heavy side of things (RAW HM1000 in my profile photo). I'm not crazy about bullpups or anything trendy. What's the light .177 PCP equivalent of the classic HW30s? 

Everything I run through is either lower quality price-point driven product or a high-tech uber cannon. But I'd gladly drop $500-$1500 for a simple, 6-lb, high shot count low velocity .177 with a moderate scope... I'd just like some nice wood and bluing (or something of the same caliber) without any cheap shortcuts. Something better quality than Crosman or Gamo (no offense, I know they run well). 

Nothing snaps to mind, any suggestions? 


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DavidEnoch
(@davidenoch)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 261
2018-05-12 21:37:26  

The CZ or AA S200 is a good option.  It is about the same weight and size and is very accurate. The FWB 700 Jr. Is a more expensive option.

David Enoch


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bReTt
(@brett)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 75
2018-05-12 21:41:56  

Maybe the Brocock Bantam?  They sure do seem like nice rifles.  I’m thinking about one.  

Ice cold milk and chocolate chip cookies any day!


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farmerjoe99
(@farmerjoe99)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 5
2018-05-12 21:45:15  

First gun that comes to mind is a Air Arms s200 just a plain jain reliable and accurate, with an ok shot count

its a simple proven system wouldn't say its the best value but their track record speaks for its self and it seems to match your description

would also take at the S510 carbine if you are willing to spend a bit more.


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gdpolk
(@gdpolk)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 8
2018-05-12 21:49:15  

For a sporter, the S200 would be a great choice.  For a more target oriented rig, I would look at some 10m guns (potentially youth sized if small/light are a goal).  Most 10m rigs are shooting mid 550-650fps with little 8gr .177 pellets and have plenty of shots per fill to get through some longer games and shooting sessions.


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JohnL57
(@johnl57)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 38
2018-05-12 22:38:40  

X3 on the S200-an added bonus is they operate on a 2600 psi fill so they're very hand pump or scuba tank friendly.


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Shambozzie
(@tharris281sc-rr-com)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 106
2018-05-13 10:37:36  

+4 on the cz/aa s200. As good as it gets.  Need a little more power. Switch out the tp with a 3mm x 10 mm socket screw and turn hammer spring in until gun won't cock. Then back off until gun cock. Fill to 180b down to 130b. Shot string start at 870 fps with jsb 8.4 rise to 905 and back down to 870 for 30 shots.  Need more ump from same gun. I have 2 air tubes for mine. One with the pot removed and tweek the valve spring.  Now with jsb 10.3  and start fill pressure of 170b  shot string start at 870 rise to 905 and down to 870 for 25 shots. Tube #1 14/15 fpe. Tube #2 with pot removed 18+ fpe . No change to tp or hammer spring for both tubes.

 


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BeemanR7
(@beemanr7)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 15

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Limbshaker
(@limbshaker)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 53
2018-05-13 13:41:32  

I'm not an FX fan, but I have to say one of the best performing rifles I have ever owned is a Cyclone (mine is actually a Webley Spectre, just a rebadged Cyclone)

Super lightweight, crazy accurate with a variety of pellets and very frugal on air. The 3 position power adjuster is pretty trick too. I have mine set for 12fpe, 15fpe, 18fpe with the flick of a switch. Very nice stock as well. Since it doesn't waste much air, it doesnt take much to get them quiet either. 

If you can find one, snatch it up.

But then again, most all quality PCPs get really sweet below 12fpe, and especially in .177. They use little air so you can spend more time shooting, and they tend to be very quiet. Just look at the Brits and what they do with theirs. 

 

Speed doesn't mean a thing without precision.


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ribbonstone
(@ribbonstone)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 238
2018-05-13 13:50:06  

All things considered...length/weight/performance/price/shot count....AA 200T (.177). 

 

 

Set up to the same speed as a typical HW30, expect  lot of very accurate shots(122cc) and the tube fills real easy.

 

 

OK...just 40 shots...but at this level, could well have been 60 shots


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Hector J Medina G
(@hector-j-medina-g)
Member of Trade
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 286
2018-05-13 16:57:44  

I have one. Have had it for about 15 years.

I have two barrels for it: 0.20" cal, and 0.177"

It can shoot at up to 17 ft-lbs in 0.20"

I had to match three air bottles so that I could swap them and still have the same POI.

Not impossible, but not the best shot count/most efficient carbine.

I would suggest you take a look at the DIANA Stormrider.

A regulated gun will yield upwards of 50 shots in 0.177" at 12 ft-lbs. and upwards of 80 shots at 5.5 ft-lbs.

It is light and slender, but it still has a full size LOP.

The barrel is free floated in the barrel band, so they can be quite accurate. At 5.5 and 12 ft-lbs the LDC does a VERY creditable job of being discreet.

It is also one of the few carbines that offers a true left handed action for those that need one (the magazine is still inserted from the left, though).

For under $300 you can get a regulated version and with the two setups (12 and 5.5 ft-lbs), you can get one for around $350.

If you are interested, you can read some more about the carbine here:

https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/exploring-the-diana-stormrider-part-1-the-trigger-and-the-power-plant-in-017745-mms-cal  

https://www.ctcustomairguns.com/hectors-airgun-blog/exploring-the-diana-stormrider-part-2-the-performance-at-sub-600-fps  

Stock and steel are nicely finished, Aluminum receiver is hard anodized and Lasered with brand and serial #.

HTH

 

 

HM


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FireMarshal
(@pat)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 97
2018-05-13 22:50:02  

Frankly,

You might want to take a look at the Benjiman Discovery in .177 . It is inexpensive and pretty accurate with 7.9 JSB's or even Crossman pellets . I have a friend that shot one for a while at the Good Ole boy's club in Pulaski, TN. He did very well out to 55 yards and it's lightweight.

Pat


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Rick C
(@rick-c)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 8
2018-05-14 10:50:47  

Just going to toss this out, you need a chronograph to tune these things.  I've modified my Crosman Challenger to shoot about 7.4 ft/lbs. (about the same as a HW30) The Challengers come with LW barrels, good triggers, fiberglass adjustable stock and you can use sites or scope. With this mod one hole groups out to 30 yds are the norm, it get 60 shots with an ES of 18 fps and is still back yard friendly. Fill to 1800 psi and shoot down to 1100, only uses 700 psi of air from a 126 cc tube, so it is very easy on air. This mod is easy, only one part is modified, a little easy disassembly and you can get to the TP, remove it and drill the TP to .068 (use #51), reassembly and you just need to set the hammer energy to give 650-655 in the middle psi range. YMMV

This is now my favorite target rifle

Rick C.


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ChrisLJ
(@pb82air)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 3
2018-05-14 17:28:45  

I have the Air Arms T200 which is very nice if you like target sights. I have replaced the stock rear sight with a Gehmann Compact unit and an Anschutz adjustable iris (.8-2.2mm). I also got the other tank with the fitting instead of the gage to make it quicker to fill. Very light, compact and accurate. 


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ribbonstone
(@ribbonstone)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 238
2018-05-14 17:38:31  

OK...everything but ONE THING on the Challenger PCP is good. Has the accuracy, good trigger, adjustable stock, etc.

But it has the stupid ball-bearing locked stright pull bolt. If yours hasn't been a problem, you are in the minority. I've had to fix mine 6 times....and I'm tired of fixing it the right way, so just stuck a rubber band on the T-handle.
Then they decided to use a littrle skinny O-ring to lock the system together. Now o-rings do some jobs really well, but acting as a locking device isn't one of them.

They really have no excuse for the over complicated straight pull bolt. Crosman had a simple version on their Challenger 2000 12gr. co2 rifle that worked and never gave any trouble, but it ran with a mehcnaical latch.

So they knew better....they had a super simple system that worked...could have used something like it on the PCP version,,,,but decided to create a ball bearing roller lock.

 

So...even thought I own and shoot one (now with a rubber band fix as I'll BE DAMNED if I fix that bugger a 7th time in 8 years), it's the same price as an AA 200T.

 

The 200T doesn't have the adjustable stock (although there were some at one time), but the US versions are very easy to adjust...at least as accurate (difference is like 1/20ths of an inch for 10 X 5-shot averages @ 20 yards).

So...yeah...I have a Challenger 2009 PCP...and a CZ 200T. It would be a perfonace contest IF NOT FOR THE CROSMAN BOLT.

 

Cost is about the same...AA 200T (CZ made) is the better gun.

 


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pluric
(@pluric)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 461
2018-05-14 21:32:43  
Posted by: Rick C

Just going to toss this out, you need a chronograph to tune these things.  I've modified my Crosman Challenger to shoot about 7.4 ft/lbs. (about the same as a HW30) The Challengers come with LW barrels, good triggers, fiberglass adjustable stock and you can use sites or scope. With this mod one hole groups out to 30 yds are the norm, it get 60 shots with an ES of 18 fps and is still back yard friendly. Fill to 1800 psi and shoot down to 1100, only uses 700 psi of air from a 126 cc tube, so it is very easy on air. This mod is easy, only one part is modified, a little easy disassembly and you can get to the TP, remove it and drill the TP to .068 (use #51), reassembly and you just need to set the hammer energy to give 650-655 in the middle psi range. YMMV

This is now my favorite target rifle

Rick C.

I was going to put a plug in for the Challenger as well. The OP had said no Crosman guns. I'm one of the lucky ones who has never had an issue with the T bar cocking. (knock on wood) I have an R7 and a HW 30 so I think they compare well with the Challenger. I also have a Discovery that with a little trigger work and an LDC will compete quite well too.


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Rick C
(@rick-c)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 8
2018-05-15 09:41:14  

I too am one of the lucky one's, never an issue with the bolt. But I know others have had problems. I did notice the other day you can get an entire new bolt assembly from Archer for $20. Seems like an easy fix if you do have issues.

Rick C.


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ribbonstone
(@ribbonstone)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 238
2018-05-15 16:46:09  

If I had took that course, not including shipping,  I'd be already $120 in repairs.

 

Took the bolt apart.  I do have a rebuild kit still in my desk drawer, but I just went with the rubber band.  Shoots as well as it ever did, no gas leaking.

 

 

A word about that Challenger.  Was told by another poster that they had them on Amazon for $ rather than $$ (the exact amount escapes me, but like 33% less than PA's cost.   I jumped on it.  When I re-checked 10 hours later, the price was corrected to about PA's price, but they honored the order and the "oops" price.

 

This is not the4 first time that's happened.   Ended up with a BSA Lightening SE XL (gas spring)  in .25 on one of those Amazon "oops"....they do correct them pretty quickly, but they do honor the ad price if you jump on it.

 

 


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doug bruestle
(@doug-bruestle)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 93
2018-05-15 21:22:05  
Posted by: bReTt

Maybe the Brocock Bantam?  They sure do seem like nice rifles.  I’m thinking about one.  

Fits the bill. I have 3. I also own 6 HW30/R7. One thing you didn't mention is whether or not noise is a consideration? I had an Air Arms T200 and probably the only thing I didn't like about the gun is the level of noise the gun produced. It's loud. If backyard friendly IS a consideration, I can tell you first hand the Bantam is good in that department. I have 2 in .177 and 1 in .22 Shot count is high on both the full power .177 and .22, but one of my .177 Bantams has been tuned @ AOA to be 13 ftlbs. at the highest setting (3 stage power adjuster) This gun gets 240 shots on a fill and is extremely quiet. Comes in handy when I shoot in my backyard. Turn the power adjuster to the lowest setting and it shoots the same speed as the HW30...I shoot it in my basement @ 10 meters. Soon the new version will be out w/ regulator. Personally I don't see the need for it. The gun is killer accurate, won my class at the state championships last year in field target Hunter class. Guess you can tell I love mine. AND they are on sale right now.


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